Kyle Bell turned childhood hustle into a 40,000-square-foot sports marketing enterprise, building wealth through relationship capital, authenticated memorabilia, and nearly $24 million raised for charity. In this episode, we explore how passion became an asset class and how access became the real currency.
Kyle Bell turned childhood hustle — selling candy, pet rocks, and autographs — into Bell Sports Marketing, a multi-division enterprise spanning authenticated memorabilia, large-scale charity auctions, and custom framing. In this episode of Significance of Wealth, Kyle shares how relationship capital, disciplined risk-taking, and long-term thinking helped transform a passion for sports into a scalable business.
Host Tom Ruggie and Kyle explore the evolution of sports memorabilia from hobby to recognized alternative asset category, including the difference between established “blue-chip” legacy pieces and more speculative current-player opportunities. They also discuss how the collectibles market shifted during COVID, the importance of authentication and provenance, and why collectibles can carry both emotional and financial value.
In addition, Kyle reflects on building enterprise value, scaling through uncertainty, and raising nearly $24 million for charitable causes through memorabilia-driven fundraising.
This conversation offers perspective on entrepreneurship, alternative assets, and what meaningful wealth looks like beyond traditional balance sheets.
Watch the episode on our YouTube channel and subscribe for more content: @SignificanceofWealthPodcast
Learn more about Destiny Family Office at www.DestinyFamilyOffice.com
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Martie Salt: Welcome to the Significance of Wealth Podcast, where we explore the evolving landscape of wealth management, private investments, and collecting as both a passion and investment strategy.
I'm Martie Salt, and today we have a guest whose story is proof that the most valuable assets you can build aren't always on a balance sheet.
Kyle Bell is the founder of Bell Sports Marketing, a Scottsdale-based sports and entertainment marketing firm with over 25 years of experience brokering some of the most high-profile appearance and endorsement deals in the industry. Kyle has earned exclusive relationships with the biggest names in sports and entertainment such as Magic Johnson, Travis Kelce, and Shaquille O’Neal, and he's spent decades mastering the art of turning access and trust into a thriving business.
But Bell Sports Marketing is just the beginning. Kyle also heads Press Pass Collectibles, a full-service memorabilia company bringing collectors face-to-face with authenticated pieces from their favorite athletes and celebrities. He founded CBU Auctions, which has raised over 23 million dollars for charities including Make-A-Wish and Phoenix Children's Hospital. And he runs Frameworks Picture Framing Studio, a custom framing operation that serves collectors and designers alike.
Today, Kyle joins Tom to talk about building a business empire on the foundation of relationships, what it really means to invest in something you love, and how he defines significance after 25 years at the intersection of sports, wealth, and giving back.
Now here's your host, Tom Ruggie.
Tom: Welcome to another edition of Significance of Wealth. I have with me today, Kyle Bell. I've gotten to know Kyle pretty well over the last year or so. we're both members of, of Tiger 21, and Kyle lives in Scottsdale, Arizona. But , as we'll talk about, he's living a very cool life, in my opinion. Kinda what my secondary passion is, which is the sports memorabilia market. So, we're gonna talk a little bit today about, know, how he turned, uh. [00:02:00] Growing up as a kid and selling baseball cards and selling other things to raise money. How he turned that in that, that passion into a very big business, very successful business.
And so Kyle, great to have you on.
Kyle Bell: Hey Tom, thanks for having me. I appreciate you having me on and looking forward to doing this.
Tom: So we'll we will get, get right into this. You know, again, Kyle, somebody I've, I've really enjoyed speaking with. we've got some similarities and background. You know, I mentioned selling candy and selling baseball cards and, you know, as a kid doing whatever, whatever you could do to make money.
I I, I've got the exact same story and, and frankly, I used to wash cars and mow lawns and do whatever, and that I'd go spend it on baseball cards. And, here I've got Kyle who, grew up. Loving sports as a kid. And now, you know, you've, you've taken that passion that a lot of us had growing up and you've turned it into a big business.
So give us a little background on kind of what got you from [00:03:00] the, the very beginning to, to where you are right now.
Kyle Bell: Absolutely. Well, uh, yeah, yeah. Growing up I always had a entrepreneurial, uh, spirit and, you know. That's what I've, I've always done. I was, uh, just like you were selling candy when you were, uh, in school. Like, I did the same thing, man. I would go to Costco, have my mom take me to Costco on the weekends, and I'd go, uh, buy, you know, bulk candy and I would sell it at school.
So same thing. Then I, uh, when I was young, when I was six years old, you know, some kids would have a lemonade stand. I had a pet rock stand that I was selling in the neighborhood. So, you know, always, it was always something, always, always, always a hustle of some sort. So, uh, when I was in school, like I said, I was selling candy.
Started collecting baseball cards, I would, I started selling, uh, grab bags outta my backpack. I would, uh, on the weekends I would,
Tom: Grab bags - that's awesome.
Kyle Bell: I would actually wrap, I wrap cards up and I would have, you know, when, you know, Shaquille O'Neal had a rookie, you know, his rookie year, and I would say, Hey guys, can you get the Shaquille O'Neal rookie card in here and, you know, buy, buy a couple of 'em.
And I would sell out every time I, I did that. So, yeah, it was same, same path, man. Just, you know, always trying to [00:04:00] hustle and trying to figure out a way to, make a buck and, you know, kinda led me into. Uh, you know, as I said, I was a card collector and eventually I I went to my mom, uh, and I said, you know, the card, the card market's just really oversaturated.
You know, it was like 12 years old or something like that. I'm like, there's just so much. It's, it's just cheap junk. I want to get into, uh, autographs. I think that, that, that's, that's where things are gonna go. I think that's, I have a better, better way to. Make some money doing that. So, um, you know, going to card card shows on the weekend and seeing some people selling autographs.
And I would actually start, started going into the hotels where the basketball teams and football teams were, uh, coming in, you know, to play the, the Phoenix Suns and the Cardinals and whatnot. And I would get autographs from the players and, uh, I would, I would sell, you know, get, keep a couple for myself, sell a couple, and kind of finance my,
Tom: ' cause
Kyle Bell: yeah.
Spring. Yeah, spring.
Tom: got spring
Kyle Bell: Sure, sure. Spring training and the whole deal, you know, and, uh, eventually I. I would, uh, yeah, I'd go out for the musicians when they came into town. And so instead of getting an [00:05:00] afterschool job when I was a kid, you know, which a lot of kids do at, you know, 14, 15 years old, whatever it may be.
Uh, I never did that. I never went to, you know, get that, uh, you know, afterschool, you know, deal. I, I, I would just kind of hustle and go down to the hotels and cut outta school early. 'cause I wasn't the most studious person in the world, but. Um, yeah, I would, uh, I, I would do that and I would sell, sell autographs, and I would, I was making a lot more money than, you know, everyone else my age, which was fun.
So I kept that passion going. I, I rode that through college, uh, went to Arizona State, uh, had a great time at a SU. Glad, I glad I had that experience there. It was awesome. But I was, uh. Going to the Pro Bowl, um, in Hawaii, golf tournaments, you know, things like that around the country. I would actually go to my professors and I would tell 'em what I do.
I said, you know, hey, here's, this is how I'm paying. I, I paid my way through college. I said, here's what I'm doing. This is how I'm putting myself through college. So, uh, they would allow me to, you know, miss a test, make it up or whatever it was, and they thought I was pretty cool what I was doing. I kind of showed him, you know, my, my world.
Tom: Your own [00:06:00] business plan.
Kyle Bell: Yeah, essentially like a, you know, a, a kid's business plan. Exactly. So, you know, you know, 18, 19, 20 years old, uh, graduated college and, you know, had the opportunity to go get an entry level job somewhere. But I looked at the, I looked at it and I said, you know, I'm making more money now than getting an entry level job somewhere.
So I just kind of just kept doing it. And organically, it grew from, you know, the Memora ability side, which I, you know, made relationships with some a athletes and celebrities and whatnot. I would pay them for. For their, you know, to do deals with me. And, um, just kind of rode that and, and kept it going.
now, looking back, 20 some odd years later, and I'm still here, so, you know, we have a, we have a great company, great people, So, the company's Bell Sports Marketing, that's the, the parent company essentially.
And then, under that we have, press Mass Collectibles, which is the memorabilia side of the business. We have a charity auction, fundraising side, which I started in, um, late two thousands. we basically, we [00:07:00] raised money for charities, foundations around the country. We raised, you know, over 23, close to $24 million for charities.
Using our platform. And it's, you know, that actually started because people would always ask me for donations, for events and whatnot. And I eventually, it got to the point where I'm like, the light bulb went off and I thought, you know, I think there's a business here. I think I could actually do a great thing, raise money, and also, you know, make it a profit center essentially.
So, we have a great team of people. we have people who've been with us for, you know, 10 plus year employees. A great, you know, great exec team. You know, we have about 50 somewhat employees and, contractors around the country that help us with our events and, and our activations.
We have a custom framing studio, so a lot of the events that we do, we have framed items like you see behind me. Uh, so we, you know, we control our room destiny.
Everything we, we do in house. yeah, it's, it's a lot of fun. I mean, you know, it's, it really is. You know, there's, there's, it's work. It definitely is work, but, you know, I get to hang out with some cool people and, have some pretty [00:08:00] fun experiences.
Tom: Yeah, but also doing, being able to do something you're passionate about and. Not only do well yourself financially, but also be able to give back significantly. I mean, $23 million, that's, that's significant. That's, uh,
Kyle Bell: It really is.
Tom: that's, it's, it's, it's a great, it's a great combination even though I, you know, I know you work your ass off, but, um,
Kyle Bell: Yeah, true.
Tom: what you're doing.
Kyle Bell: Yeah. Yeah. There's, uh, you know, as I said, just like anything, it's, it is a lot of fun, you know? Definitely, uh, it's definitely a niche, definitely a niche business.
Well, as, as I've already mentioned, we have, we have a lot in common. Uh, but, but you can also see the age difference between us because there was, there was no Costco when, uh, when I was buying candy. I had to, I had to ride my bike and stop at the, the local seven 11 and pick up a bunch of Jolly Ranchers for 5 cents each, and I'd sell 'em for a quarter each.
That's, that's good. That's good. That's good. ROI. There you go.
Tom: is, it is, is. But one thing that, that you mentioned that you know, 'cause I, I used to, to go and chase the athletes as well for autographs, again,
Kyle Bell: Okay.
Tom: in, in [00:09:00] Florida spring
Kyle Bell: Sure.
Tom: so was, was there anybody that, that, when you were growing up that was. A difficult autograph to get.
But, but you were able to succeed because for me, that person was, was, uh, Greg Maddox. Um,
Kyle Bell: Yeah.
Tom: was, Greg was not known for being a very generous or good signer. And yet, for whatever reason, virtually every time I, I could literally see, I could recognize his walk from a hundred yards away. the minute I saw him, single time I ever asked him for an autograph, he came over and signed for me.
Kyle Bell: It's awesome. Yeah, there, there's definitely guys that are, um, are definitely interesting in the way they. They act and react to, to fans. And you know, there is a component of these days of, uh, you know, all these guys believe that, you know, all these adults that are asking for autographs are just gonna sell ' em.
Tom: Mm-hmm.
Kyle Bell: some guys will only sign for kids, you know, I mean, notoriously like Patrick Ewing was an extremely, extremely difficult signature to get. He was just [00:10:00] very, just not, not the most pleasant person.
Tom: in the world. Yeah.
Kyle Bell: Yeah, he really wasn't So. That's one. I don't think I ever actually got him until I started paying him. Um, you know, it's, it's funny, you know, some of these guys, they, they're, you know, Dr.
Jekyll, Mr. Hyde, you mentality, uh, where in public, they're not the nicest people, but when you have 'em behind closed doors and they're getting, they're getting, you know, paid, then you know, the mood changes and, you know, it's, it's a business, you know, opportunity. And they like it. But, you know, um, Willie Mays was always a tough one in spring training here.
You know, he was, you know, he's a huge name, obviously, and, you know, one of the greatest baseball players to ever, ever live. And, uh, you know, he was always a really tough one, uh, you know, to get, but I was, he was one of my first autographs I ever got actually at, uh, giant Spring training. So he was, he was one that, uh, he was sitting at a table and yeah, he wasn't, wasn't the most pleasant guy, but he was, you know, sign, sign some autographs.
And so that, that was, that was definitely one that was, that was pretty cool. And I don't know what I, honestly, that was probably. You know, 12, 13 years old, [00:11:00] and so I don't know what happened to that baseball, but somebody probably has it now. I, I don't think I, I really don't know what happened to it.
Tom: So, you know, you, you kind of got up into the early twenties and, you know, you were in college and you, you were able to get your professors to let you fly to Hawaii for the Pro Bowl and stuff, but when was, when was that first moment that you're like, wow, I'm, I'm developing a real business here. Like, what, what clicked, what took place?
Kyle Bell: And I'm, I, you know, I, I say this jokingly, but a little bit. Seriously. I'm still waiting for it. I'm, uh, you know, it's, it's one of those situations where. All this is all I've ever known. This is all I've ever done. So, you know, that's one of the things that I really enjoy about, you know, being Tiger 21, is, you know, I'm surrounded by some really bright, amazing, successful people that.
I've done things so differently than I have that, um, you know, just kind of rely opener. But, you know, I think when I, maybe when I bought my first building, that was, that was kind of a, wow moment. I bought my first building, it's a, it was a [00:12:00] 20,000 square foot, office showroom warehouse, and it was, it was just kind of, you know, I remember walking around one night after I bought the building.
You know, scared outta my mind because it just took on a huge debt and, you know, thinking, man, how's this gonna work? And, you know, that was just kind of the light bulb kind of went off and said, you know, the, the, there's something here. You know, there's, there's something that that's working, something that's working for me and, you know, the great people I have working with me.
So It was a, a cool transition. And then since then, we have a couple buildings now. We're in about 40,000 square feet of, office warehouse showrooms and frame studio and you know, every, everything we have going on. sometimes it's still kind of a, a cool moment to take a minute when everyone leaves and, you know, walk around.
I'll walk around at the end of the day and, you know, just think, okay, it's kinda working out. You know, I, I. Didn't really, you know, uh, didn't have a crystal ball back in, uh, my early twenties and had no idea where I was going or what, what was gonna happen. And, you know, if, uh, the bottom would fall outta this business, who knows?
And I would have to go get a job somewhere, which [00:13:00] I'm pretty much on hireable in my opinion, because I've never done anything else. So, you know, that's always been, kind of a thought in the back of my head.
Tom: Well, I don't, I don't see that happening. I mean, let's, let's talk a little bit about, you know, some of the relationships that you have. I mean, you've got relationships with. Some of the biggest names in sports and even outside of sports. correct me if I'm wrong, but I, I believe you handled Chevy Chase.
You handled Travis Kelsey, em, Ms. Smith, magic Johnson, and a plethora others. So, how were you able to develop those relationships and then turn it into of a juggernaut of, I, I mean, I don't know how many relationships like that you have, but I, I have to guess it's probably 30, 40, 50 people that
Kyle Bell: Yeah, there, there's, yeah. So we, we have,
Tom: to you.
Kyle Bell: yeah. Yeah. So we have exclusive deals with a lot of athletes and it's just, just being in this business for a long time and, you know, meeting the athletes and, some deals we do, through the agencies, some we do directly with the, uh, the athletes themselves.
I have some that, we love, I love working with [00:14:00] and, you know, love to see 'em every time I have the opportunity. And there's other guys that it's just a business relationship and, some guys are, you know, always have a smile and they're always great. And some guys it's, you know, just business. They come in, they do their job, and, and that, that's it is what it is. But that, that's fine. that's kind of, that's how it is, you know, just with people in life, you have some people that you work with and, um, you know, you, you're not gonna grab a, a, a glass of wine or a, you know, cocktail with them after.
And there's some guys that, you know, that, that happens. And, like I said, I, I find myself in some super cool situations where, um. I'm like, wow, how did I, how did I get here? This is pretty cool. You know? And in other, other times it's like, I can't wait to get outta here and let's, you know, tomorrow's another day.
Tom: So So you've grown this, you know, you mentioned the, the press pass collectibles you mentioned your auction company, your framing company. and again, you, you alluded to it when you were six years old or eight years old, that, there's always been kind of this entrepreneurial streak, but, when you around your office and, and you look at what [00:15:00] you've done and where you are, I mean, was there intentionality behind all that? Or, or did things just kind of progress along and, and you opportunistically open another door to, you know, to start a charitable endeavor to start your framing studio or, you know, so, so like, where's the entrepreneurial streak and is that, is that still, is that still there for you?
Kyle Bell: Yeah. So, you know, as a, we've spoken before about it. when I was younger, when I was in my early twenties, I was doing everything and anything. I sold cars, I'd buy used cars and sell 'em. I had a clothing company at one point I had an HVAC company, but I was always doing memorabilia.
And, um, got to the point where, you know, you can't, you can't give a hundred percent of attention to five different things. You know, you can only give, you know, 20% to each. So. When I kind of, you know, realized that the profit center, the, the, the thing that was doing best for me, and I knew the best was this, this business.
You know, I, took that opportunity and I, you know, sat back and I said, you know, I think I need to stop doing [00:16:00] all this stuff that's taking my bandwidth and my time and just focus on, you know, the, the higher hanging fruit, which I, which I knew I knew best. So, you know, that was, uh. That was kinda the moment where I just, you know, realized I need to put the, put the time and the work in and, and make this, the priority.
I'm still, you know, every day I'm still trying to figure it out. I mean, I, I, I'm, self-diagnosed, ADD so I, that's probably why I have all these different divisions and all these different things that go on and, you know, we're, we're always opening or we're always starting new endeavors and, uh, new.
Revenue streams, but within, within the business, you know, essentially, so for instance, we're on our charity side of the company, we developed a, a charitable software, you know, an event management software that's we've been working on for a couple years and we just launched that and it's something where we can, you know, assist charities on the other side and not just, consigning them, auction items to sell their events, but actually help managing their events as well.
So it's like a, a, a spiderweb of, lots of different opportunities and just figuring out which ones are gonna be the best [00:17:00] opportunities to make the best return.
Tom: I think, I think most of us that are entrepreneurs have that same, you know, DD syndrome.
Kyle Bell: Yeah, absolutely.
Tom: know. I, I, I know I certainly do and, and, I wouldn't have diagnosed it at an early age, but, uh, as I've, as I've gotten more and more into business and entrepreneurial, it, it, definitely, you know, seems to be there.
'cause there's always, you know, new opportunities present themself and, and, um, you know, you wanna have an open mind to those sorts of things. So along that line, is there a moment in time where you were scaling your business that something happened that, that, that scared you a little bit. I mean, for me it was the 08' timeframe and, and, uh, I learned a lot from that, but, but you know, what's, what's been your scariest moment in
Kyle Bell: So.
Tom: and what did you learn from it?
Kyle Bell: Yeah, that, that's, that's great to go into actually. So, you know, during, uh, you know, the financial crash of, oh eight, not oh nine, um, I wasn't, you know, obviously scaled to where I am now, [00:18:00] so I really didn't have, it wasn't that much of an impact. It's interesting 'cause in this business I feel that people, um, it is a luxury, but I, I feel that people.
I love it. Love this so much. I love the memorabilia and love the, you know, cards and whatnot that people were still spending money on, on this stuff for that time, which is, which is crazy to to hear, but it's true. the biggest scare probably was, was COVID. You know, the uncertainty of, 2020,
I remember, you know, coming in the office and, uh, we had, you know, we had to lay off a few people and, the world closed down and that was probably the scariest moment. But then what happened was, is this business took off like a rocket ship and it was because everyone
Tom: catapult your business.
Kyle Bell: had, yeah, it, it, it really, it really did.
So.
Tom: was probably the best thing for your business.
Kyle Bell: It, it was, it, it was, I mean, you know, it was for the business. It was great for the world. It was, it was not. Um, but yeah, it was definitely a situation where we, we ended up, it was actually funny. I'm involved in a [00:19:00] group. We got a couple of us, you know, uh. Our, um, partners together and some of the exclusive deals, and we didn't know what we were gonna do.
Right. We couldn't, we couldn't go do our show. You know, we, we do a, we have a big, sports, card memorabilia show on the East Coast that was canceled, obviously. Uh, so what we ended up doing was we went to, Dallas, Texas for 10 days. We rented a ballroom in a hotel, a massive ballroom, and we had. 40, 50, 60 players come in over a 10 day span and sign thousands upon thousands upon thousands of pieces.
And we were the only people doing it this at that time. And the demand was so high that it was just, it was amazing. We were, we were able to, everything we, we got, we were able to sell. that that really, you know, was a, it was a great thing for the business at that time.
It was, it was wild. We actually ended up doing that twice in 20, 20 20 and I think beginning of 21. but you know, nobody, nobody was doing anything like that. So we were able to supply, all our [00:20:00] wholesalers and retail and, you know, eBay website, Amazon, all the, all the sales channels were, were booming.
So it was, it was quite a wild situation.
Tom: Yeah, it was so along, along those lines, I mean, like I said, I, I think COVID was, for the sports memorabilia market period. I think it was the absolute best thing that's ever happened to the market and I write a lot of content about this now because I think that's the, the timeframe that the transition went from being really solely a hobby from a collector standpoint. it becoming more of, of an investment or, or at least
Kyle Bell: Absolutely.
Tom: with investment opportunities such as art. I think it's transitioned into,
Kyle Bell: I agree.
Tom: Know, art and coins and things like that. So, outta curiosity, when, when you're talking to [00:21:00] somebody about sports memorabilia, I mean, do you, do you talk about it as a passion?
Do you talk about it as a, as an investment, or is it kind of somewhere in the
Kyle Bell: Yeah, so it's, it, it can be both. And there's, you know, there's the run of the mill, you know, the current players, those in my opinion are not investments. You know, you have a, a prospect, you know, there was the other day, Cooper Flag, who was the first pick in the NBA draft this year. his, debut jersey sold for I think over a million dollars now.
Somebody spent a million dollars on that jersey. He hasn't played a full season in the NBA. And that's, you know, that's, somebody's looking at that as an investment, obviously, but, but it's a huge gamble,
Tom: they're looking
Kyle Bell: so,
Tom: $10 million jersey.
Kyle Bell: right, right. So, you know, you have that, those situations and you have, you know. Um, I mean, years ago, the what, babe Ruth's, Called Shot
Was it the jersey or, uh, the Jersey sold for 20 something million dollars. I mean, yeah, 2020 $4 million. I mean, that's, that's an investment and that [00:22:00] is, it's an unbelievable piece and it's not gonna go down in value. Uh, so when you're looking at those kind of pieces that are, you know, the prospect pieces, which is the, I'd say the Cooper flag jersey, but the investment piece is the, the vapor roof and plenty of others like that.
So now that you're seeing. You know, funds come in, private equity, you know, big hitters are coming in and they're actually putting money into this as they would art, as they would a, you know, Monet or, you know, an art piece or whatever it may be, or collectible coins. You know, that's, that's what this business is moving to.
But again, you have, you have the run of the mill, you know, players like a, Tyreek Hill or a, you know, whoever may be. You have players like that? Like I wouldn't consider them an investment. I consider that more like, you know, the passion that somebody's a big fan of that player. So that's, that's, it's, it's really interesting to see what's happened since, and since 2020 prices have skyrocketed.
If you look at, if you compare, uh, I actually presented to my Tiger group a couple months ago and I put together a, a deck [00:23:00] on, uh, you know, the s and p versus, um. Memorabilia and I put X amount of, you know, certain pieces in a, in a chart and I said, this is what I purchased them for. This is what I've sold them for over time.
And it's outperformed, you know, the market essentially by, you know, quite a large number, you know, and obviously you have to buy, right? It's a, it's like buying a stock or it's like, you know, being money manager essentially, but it just in different.
Tom: that that came to you afterwards and said, all right, all right, Kyle, I wanna invest. What do I do?
Kyle Bell: I, a couple have talked to me about it and you know, I just,
Tom: I.
Kyle Bell: I told them, I told them I'm happy to, guide them the best I can. But, you know, I would always, give some free advice. I definitely would, assist them if they wanted to get into that, you know.
But yeah, some guys, uh, yeah, some guys were very interested in it. And there's, it, it is just, it's a fun, it's fun. It's a, you know, honestly, it's a lot more fun than. Investing in, you know, some other things that are, you know, out there that aren't, as fun. I mean, you can invest in real estate and real estate's awesome and it's a great investment, but at the same time you can't, you know, it doesn't have that sentimental value as a, you know, a wool Chamberlain game [00:24:00] used Jersey or a Babe Ruth, or all these Michael Jordan or, you know, any of these items that are, you know, just going up and up in value.
Tom: tell,
Kyle Bell: it's interesting.
Tom: the, the difference from an investment standpoint. And I'm gonna use the two examples you used of, of a Cooper Flag jersey and a Babe Ruth jersey. do you distinguish the two of those separately as a quote unquote investment?
Kyle Bell: Well, as I said, I think a, a Cooper flag or a current player is more of a, you're, it's a prospect. you're prospecting essentially. you know, like, yo Nicole Yoic on the, uh, nuggets he is going could go down as one of the best players to ever play the game, but he's still playing. I mean, I like to con, I like to consider the investment pieces are guys that have cemented their legacy in, you know, in the game.
And, uh, I, you know, if I'm, if I'm collecting or if I'm, you know, acquiring for myself, I'm looking more for. The high [00:25:00] end pieces of, of those, of those guys versus the, the current players. But, you know, again, it's more of a gamble if it's current player, but you're gonna get a, potentially get a better deal, you know, versus what, what they're gonna do later.
Tom: current player as well. But to your point, he already, I mean, he could retire today and he's already
Kyle Bell: sure.
Tom: his
Kyle Bell: Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely.
Tom: I always talk about it in terms of, of blue chip investing, which, you know, Michael Jordan, babe Ruth, LeBron James, uh, you know, there's, there's certain, certain people that, that just aren't gonna go down in value regardless. a penny stock. So like I, I, I'd say, I'd say Cooper Flag is, is a penny stock. Now, I, I personally think, you know, if he doesn't get injured and and whatnot, Cooper Flag is gonna be amazing and somebody may have made a great investment,
Kyle Bell: sure.
Tom: but the difference is there's certainly more risk on the downside for, for
Kyle Bell: Yes,
Tom: a Cooper Flag jersey versus purchasing a Michael Jordan [00:26:00] jersey.
Kyle Bell: absolutely. You're right.
Tom: Yeah,
Kyle Bell: You know,
Tom: I.
Kyle Bell: I would completely agree with that. Completely agree.
Tom: Do you still do anything in the cards space?
Kyle Bell: Um, not, not a lot. I, I'm not, I'm not as well versed as, as you are and, some other people that I, you know, talk to on a daily basis. I've never really, understood that space as well as others. it's amazing to see what's happened when you have, cards out there that are trading for, you know, millions of dollars.
Literally, they, you know, there's three known. Or there's three psa, 10 Mickey Mail, rookie cards in existence. Right. 52 Tops card. And now, they're saying the Pokemon card the other day sold for $16 million. I know nothing about Pokemon, but that's absolutely crazy.
so if a Pokemon card sells for $16 million, how much is that? that Mickey Man card, which is one of the most historic, you know, notable card in the, in the business, you know that the hoes, wagon or whatever. I mean, is that a. $30 million card. Is that $50 million card? It's is, is it? It's priceless.
Essentially. 'cause the guys, the people who own them, [00:27:00] they, they won't sell 'em. They have no interest in selling them. So
Tom: I, I don't know anything about Pokemon either,
Kyle Bell: Me
Tom: but I,
Kyle Bell: I don't.
Tom: I've written, I've written an article about, um, you know, the, the previous card before that, that sold for so much money, which is the, the Kobe logo card signed by both. I think that's sold for about 13 million
Kyle Bell: 1215, somewhere around there. Yeah.
Tom: Yeah. And, and, but, so I, I, I, I, I term, I term that as, as artificial scarcity. And I actually wrote an article called Art called, effectively called Artificial Scarcity. You know, you have companies that are creating of one cards, but, but in theory, they could create a different one of one the next year and the next year, and the next year. And what's mind boggling to me, and again, won't even talk about the Pokemon 'cause, that's completely mind boggling to me. what's mind boggling to me is that Jersey logo [00:28:00] card sold for more than either their two most expensive jerseys together. Sold for,
Kyle Bell: Yep. Yeah, absolutely. It's crazy.
Tom: I think Jordan's Jersey's one of the most expensive, you know, current. Current type jerseys in, in his last dance jersey, I wanna say sold for between seven and $8 million. And, and, and granted, and myself and myself are a lot more now,
Kyle Bell: Sure, sure. Agreed.
Tom: $13 million card. I'm like, as an investor who's also a passionate collector, I'd much rather have a game used Jersey than a, than a card with a logo on it.
Kyle Bell: Sure. I,
Tom: again.
Kyle Bell: I would agree and that, that's, that's one of the reasons why I, I, yeah. I, I can't really wrap my head around it. I think a lot of people are coming into business now and, and purchasing those cards. The people who, the group who purchased that card. If they're using it as marketing essentially, that that's really, what I see a lot of times.
So is it, um, is it investment? Is it going to, you know, are they gonna, it [00:29:00] continue to go up and up? Is it, you know, the, the big question is, is this a bubble? is it going to eventually, eventually burst?
Eventually the stuff, you know, what goes up must come down mentality, but it's, it still hasn't come down and there's no, there's no real end in sight in general.
Tom: had, we haven't
Kyle Bell: Yeah.
Tom: bubble burst either. And I don't mind telling you in, in oh eight, I made some of the absolute best. from a, a value standpoint that I've ever made in my life because things, you know, people were scared and, and I had some dry powder and things, things were a lot cheaper.
Kyle Bell: I mean, I, I bought a game used Babe Ruth bat for $16,000That's amazing. That's great. That's awesome. I mean, and, and, you know, I love hearing those stories, you know, the upside of, of that, that time because, you know, there's a lot of people that were able to, you know, maximize it and, capitalize off of it, which, is fantastic.
it's crazy to see. What's happening, you know, where this business is going and from oh eight to, in 18 years [00:30:00] to see it is a completely different, a hundred percent different. you go to, you know, I've been going to national, which I saw you in Chicago this year.
it's the largest sports convention in the country every year. And it's, being at that show in mid two thousands. Until now. It is. They're nothing alike. It is, you know, it's corporate. It's so, you know, there's, the activations in that show are unbelievable. The, people that display their items, I mean, it's.
It's a massive, massive show. And
Tom: It is
Kyle Bell: years ago it was, it was just a baseball card show, baseball cards, memorabilia, no big deal. You come in, it wasn't overly crowded. And now Wednesday afternoon it's wall to wall people. Whereas, you know, back in the day it was, no problem, just walk up to a, walk up to a vendor and buy something, move on.
And now you can't even get to the tables 'cause it's so, it's so massive.
Yeah. Do you have, do you have a, a kind of a, a thought on what things look like five or 10 years down the road?
that's a great question. I believe it's gonna continue to go up and up. I really do. I don't, I think there has to be [00:31:00] some bit of leveling off eventually. Uh, but I don't really see when that's going to happen. You know, you have, the huge companies, like a fanatics, they're doing hundreds of millions of dollars a year in sales, in this category.
And that's, you know, that's just a fraction of what they do and overall, because they're such a large company. But it's. You know, when you have a big company like that, that's really backing the industry and backing the business, you know, the, the, all the attention they're getting putting towards us. I really, I wish I had a crystal ball, man.
That, that's a great question. I wonder that every day. I can't figure it out quite yet.
Tom: Well,
Kyle Bell: Well.
Tom: is called, uh, well, I, I, I do think that there, there's going to be a, a bubble. I think it'll probably coincide with a, a stock market bubble. and I think it's going to be. Particularly harmful the newer, know, things that are quote unquote being invested in. I could certainly be [00:32:00] proven wrong.
I mean, shit, I thought, I thought when Gretzky paid 400,000 for that hoes Wagner back whenever that was, I was like, oh my gosh,
Kyle Bell: Of his mind.
Tom: his money back. And, and you know, now that card's probably worth 30, $40 million now.
Kyle Bell: Yeah.
Tom: but I, I,
Kyle Bell: Yeah.
Tom: fathom that. Somebody's gonna come in and pay more than $60 million for Pokemon.
But, but again, what, you know, what do I know? But I do, I do think there'll be a bubble at, at some point. I, I think that the new stuff is going to be most susceptible on the downside. That doesn't mean it'll permanently stay down, but, um. You know, obviously I'm in the wealth management business and I, I kind of look at assets in three different buckets and, and the, the third bucket is 20 plus years, and my memorabilia collection is, is clearly in my, in my bucket number three.
So I don't
Kyle Bell: Agreed.
Tom: about, and I'm buying blue chip stuff. I'm, I've got a lot of babe roof autographs. I've got a lot of. Michael Jordan stuff. You know, I've got a lot of Muhammad Ali, [00:33:00] I've got four Muhammad Ali fight worn trunks,
Kyle Bell: Awesome.
Tom: and you know, while I might lose 10, 20, 30, 40% on paper at any given moment on any of those, I'm not concerned about where they're gonna be 10 plus years down the road.
So.
Kyle Bell: Absolutely. And, and that, that's, if you have the hindsight or the foresight to think of it that way. Then, you know, if, if you're, if you're good with, you know, buying and holding and you know, you can enjoy the piece, which is kind of fun about this stuff because it's a tangible item that you can, you can look at and just, you know, kind of gives you the chills when you pick up an item once in a while.
Like, wow, this is just really, really cool. You know? But if you're okay, just, you know, holding onto it, you really can't, you can't lose money if you buy smart and you buy the blue chip, you know, items For sure. So you brought up that hoes Wagner, the, the Gretzky card. So it's funny that that card's actually here in, in town in, in Arizona.
Who owns the car now is actually Ken Kendrick, the owner of the Diamondbacks. And he has a phenomenal, phenomenal collection of, of cards, you know, hundreds of millions of dollars in cards, but [00:34:00] he actually owns that card now, so, yeah,
Cool. Little, little side note. So, um, Tom Zappala, who does a podcast, along with Rico Petrocelli, I've been a guest on his podcast a number of times, but, he's written, he and his wife Ellen have, have written, well I say written, they're more like coffee table books, but. They did a, a book on Ken Kendrick's card collection.
Tom: That's a pretty amazing book. but I actually was interviewed by Tom yesterday because he and Ellen are doing their last book one of multiple features in the book is gonna be my 52 signed top set. So excited
Kyle Bell: That's awesome. Very cool. I like it. I love it. That's great. That's awesome, man.
Tom: so, you know, our show's called Significance of Wealth.
You've done a, a fantastic job of building significant wealth and you've, done so the way it should be done doing something you're very passionate about. But you know what? what's on the horizon for you? Is there any more, more gold [00:35:00] shiny objects that's gonna have you start in a different company?
Or do you have anything cooking that's, that's going to expand or scale what you're currently doing? You did mention the software that you're building. Uh, what else?
Kyle Bell: Yeah. I've always kind of been on a, on the mentality of, just keep pushing forward and whatever comes, will come.
one day at a time, man.
Tom: Very cool. Let me wind down with a couple of of personal questions. So,
Kyle Bell: Sure.
Tom: what's, what's the best sports memory that you've witnessed firsthand?
Kyle Bell: Oh boy. I am a sports fan, but I believe, I think over the years, I'm, I'm a bit jaded from just being around a lot of these guys, so I don't go to a ton of a ton of games, to be honest. I think one of the, my favorite memories is, uh, 2001, uh, Diamondbacks World Series. This is actually kind of a, goes back into business a little bit.
So I have roommates at the time I'm in college. My roommate calls me and he says, Hey, if the Diamondbacks win the NLCS against the Braves, you know we're [00:36:00] going to the World Series. I'm, I'm, I'm driving down to the stadium right now 'cause they're gonna start, you know, selling World Series tickets. And I'm like, okay, well when you get down there, lemme know how it is.
So he gets down there and he is like, Hey, I'm like. Towards the front of the line. Let's, uh, you should get down here. I go down there, I jump in line with him, and, uh, they start selling the tickets. They would sell, they were selling 10 tickets per person per game, one and two. we bought 40 tickets between us.
We said, okay, let's buy 'em. We're gonna sell 'em. This is before StubHub and Ticketmaster. This is like way back in the day. Right? So you, you know, so I took a couple days off school.
Tom: outside the outside the game.
Kyle Bell: Yeah, exactly. so I took a couple daysoff school, which, which was not rare in that time. And, we sold, you know, the 40 tickets, the game one and two, and we made a bunch of money, we split it, you know, 50 50.
And, that, and then we ended up going to, you know, going to some of the games and it was just like, just, it was electric. It was so much fun, so great. And, actually took that money and I. used it for my business. I paid my credit card [00:37:00] bill off at the time 'cause that was, I was a little, you know, had a little bit of debt being in college and to pay that off, that felt great and haven't been debt ever since.
So that's great too. we had an awesome time and it was just like a super fun, amazing experience. And that, that was, that was probably one of my most fun, uh, you know, fun times that I had
Tom: That's.
Kyle Bell: and made, made a few bucks too. So that, that was pretty cool.
Tom: The, consummate entrepreneur. Love it.
Kyle Bell: Yeah, I know. It's, it's, yeah, for some, some reason I can't get away from that. So it was, it was a lot of fun.
Tom: you work with all these, these, big time athletes.I'm not gonna ask. Questions about who's tough to work with. it's obviously interesting, but not something you wanna share publicly. So I'll ask the opposite of that. So, are you willing to talk about anybody that has just like, completely exceeded your expectations and just, you know, love, love being around them and, and, uh, you know, would, would work with them and kind of in perpetuity?
Kyle Bell: Sure, sure.
Tom: a go-to?
Kyle Bell: Yeah. a couple come to mind. Chevy Chase is [00:38:00] one of my all time favorites. I've worked with him for the last 10 years. And, just the guy, every time I leave, you know, I hang out with him for a couple days. Every time I leave, my face hurts from laughing. He is, just, you know, constantly on the guy's absolutely hilarious and behind closed doors he is.
He's great. He's just, you know, he's like my, he's like my dad, you know? He is just, he's great. I've been, you know, with him in his house in New York, his house in LA and just different, different places. You know, out to dinners with him and, he's just a lot of fun, fun guy.
Um. Magic Johnson's one of my, one of my favorites that I work with. He's one of the most generous, kind people. He's absolutely amazing. He's so generous with people, with his time. When people come up to him, he's always just so engaging. And, you know, even if he's in a hurry and somebody comes up and they have a story to tell him, he listens and he's engaging it.
It's just, it's cool to see how he, how he is with people. I booked him for an event in Atlanta a couple years ago and I met him in Atlanta 'cause he was coming from somewhere else.
He was coming from, somewhere else in the country. [00:39:00] And, he calls me, before he is like, Hey, Kylie, you going back to Phoenix after I'm going back to la? He's like, do you want to just jump on the plane and I'll drop you off in Phoenix? I was like, you're gonna. Let me jump on the plane and drop me off in Phoenix and then go home.
He's like, yeah, no problem. You know, just so we jumped on his plane, very comfortable ride, obviously, and, you know, stops in, stops at Scottsdale airport, drops me off, which is about 10 minutes from my house, and, you know, he is great instead of, uh, having to take a commercial flight back. So that's just the kind of person he is.
Just a, just an awesome, great guy. Yeah.
Tom: That's awesome. All
Kyle Bell: Yeah. So,
Tom: cool.
Kyle Bell: yeah.
Tom: question along this line and, uh, I know we've had a conversation about you selling a piece of, you know, you're, you're a collector yourself, uh, I recall having a conversation about you selling a piece that you've kind of kicked yourself for, selling. is there, is there anything in your collection now that you absolutely, positively would not sell regardless
Kyle Bell: Oh boy,
Tom: somebody offered you?
Kyle Bell: yeah, well, you know, everything has the right price. Just depends if it's the right price. You know, I'm kind of in [00:40:00] the mentality of, I do have, a good amount of personal pieces that, I consider personal pieces, but, you know, if, if the right opportunity arises, I would definitely, uh, you.
Entertained. I've had some people that have, reached out to me for some pieces that I have that, just, it's just not the right, not the right dollar amount to, to let it go. 'cause, you know, maybe I, I'm a little emotionally attached to 'em, but, you know, for the most part, you know, this, this is a business and, and, you know, uh, there's so many amazing pieces out there that if you have something and you sell it, you're, you can, you can find something else that's going to essentially replace it or be able to, uh, you know.
Find something that you're gonna like, hopefully just as much, but there's, there's a few things in, in the back of a safe that I, I'm, I'm very partial to for sure.
Tom: All right, so we'll close out. again, really appreciate your time. It's been a great conversation. it's amazing what you've done in business. I, I, I think it's. Also speaks a lot of volume about you, what you're, what you're doing on the charitable [00:41:00] side.
I think that's very meaningful, uh,
Kyle Bell: Appreciate that. Thank you.
Tom: think that's, that's amazing. as far as, as contacting your companies, I mean, I often ask people if they wanna leave contact information behind. I don't, don't know that you necessarily wanna leave any personal contact information behind, but perhaps there's information about. your auction house or your framing studio or anything like that, that somebody listening to this, that, that may want to utilize your services, um,
Kyle Bell: Sure.
Tom: you the opportunity to put it out there.
Kyle Bell: Yeah, sure. Or, or just, you know, somebody that's a collector or somebody that wants to reach out and ask questions. I'm happy to, you know, happy to, oblige as well. Uh, you know, bellport marketing.com is the website and that has all of our companies on there and email. And I, I get the email actually, so I'll see that.
If somebody wants to send something in, if there's any questions or anything that I can assist with, I'd be happy to do so.
Tom: And I assume, if somebody's listening to this that has some really cool collectible pieces, they want to get rid of that, that that's something you're in the market [00:42:00] for
Kyle Bell: Yeah. We, we, we buy collections all the time. And that's something that we, that's something that we do. We, you know, travel around the country if the opportunity is, is right and, yeah, if anybody wants to, wants to reach out, I'm happy to chat with 'em and see if there's, uh, some opportunities.
Tom: Awesome. any other closing thoughts? Are you good?
Kyle Bell: No, I just, I really appreciate you having me on. I think great conversation and, you know, I always, always enjoy talking to you. every time I talk to you, I feel like you, you're like, oh, I have this, you know, blue chip piece and this and this.
So I love one of these days I'm gonna come down and I'm gonna, you know, I'm gonna get, want the tour. So it'd be great to see some person.
Tom: I'm gonna do the same. I'm going get to, to Phoenix or Scottsdale and tour your place and, uh, have you show me around. I look forward to it.
Kyle Bell: Absolutely. Yeah, absolutely. Look forward to it.
Tom: we'll talk to you soon.
Martie Salt: That brings us to the end of today's episode. Thank you for tuning in. Be sure to subscribe to Significance of Wealth on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, and anywhere else. You get your podcasts so you never miss an episode. You can also follow Tom Rouge and Destiny Family Office on LinkedIn and Destiny family office.com for more insights on wealth management, private market opportunities, and collectibles.
Until next time.
The expressed views, thoughts and opinions belong solely to the host and or guests, and are not investment recommendations or opinions issued by Destiny, wealth Partners or its affiliates. Investment advisory services are offered through Destiny Wealth Partners, LLC, and SEC, registered Investment Advisor.
Destiny Wealth Partners also conducts business under the name Destiny Family Office. Destiny Family Office Podcasts are the sole property of Destiny, family Office, and information provided is for informational and educational purposes only. Learn more at www.destinyfamilyoffice.com/disclosures.